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I cut a slot in the dash just in front of the steering wheel and above the indicator panel. Put the original SOC w hour meter back in its place. Better view in bright sun


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Well after lookin at Xfaxman pics mine is the same and not above the indicator panel. I copied his idea couple years ago


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Discussion Starter #42
3 mo + post Li upgrade and I am still amazed at how far this thing will go in here. We have 50 miles of very steep gravel roads, ranging from 1000' elevation to almost 4000' - there is one 30 mile loop at the top I could never do w lead acid even in winter unless I stopped at a friend's place on that side and charged, now it does it it with 50-60% left. I dont even have to charge every day. Question for those of you that have left lead acid behind - mine still have some juice left in them, was getting about 20 mile range, did you guys give them away or dispose of them? Post for free on Craigslist? Another question I have is what gauge power cord do you guys use to charge? It may be my imagination but it seems post Li upgrade this cord gets too hot to even handle - I think it is a 16 gauge 6'.
 

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3 mo + post Li upgrade and I am still amazed at how far this thing will go in here. We have 50 miles of very steep gravel roads, ranging from 1000' elevation to almost 4000' - there is one 30 mile loop at the top I could never do w lead acid even in winter unless I stopped at a friend's place on that side and charged, now it does it it with 50-60% left. I dont even have to charge every day. Question for those of you that have left lead acid behind - mine still have some juice left in them, was getting about 20 mile range, did you guys give them away or dispose of them? Post for free on Craigslist? Another question I have is what gauge power cord do you guys use to charge? It may be my imagination but it seems post Li upgrade this cord gets too hot to even handle - I think it is a 16 gauge 6'.
Which size Voltronix kit do you have?


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Discussion Starter #44
Which size Voltronix kit do you have?


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I went with the 210Ah 10.7 kW pack - I'd say the range is nearly double what I was getting with lead acid - we will see come winter what the reduction in range is, but lead acid had less range as well, and with as far as Im going now I should be good.
 

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When I do Li Ion conversions, I replace the std power lead with a 16a inlet sited just above the passenger cup holder. I use 1.75mm2 cable to join that to the charger (I also add a 12v maintenance charger as well) with a new iec socket. But we also use half the current you do as our mains is 230v. The main power cable to the power outlet is also 1.75mm2 . They still get slightly warm, basically you are pulling current for a lot longer. I would only use 2.5mm2 cable for any extension lead, and having used a smaller one on a site repair I fell foul of the charger not working. They do some form of voltage drop test and if too high on start up they go to fault mode. Range is so much better and more usable with the steadier voltage for longer. Its even more marked on my Li Ion versions than the earlier Lifepo4 ones that I did.
 

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---------------------------------------------------
Another question I have is what gauge power cord do you guys use to charge? It may be my imagination but it seems post Li upgrade this cord gets too hot to even handle - I think it is a 16 gauge 6'.
After my upgrade I noticed the short power splitter cord to the charger got hot while charging:
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Replaced it with a molded splitter:

23785
 

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The NOCO single and dual cord is 14awg
 

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Discussion Starter #48 (Edited)
Well I guess I jinxed myself cause yesterday's ride was a not so fun adventure. The buggy showed 60% when we left, get to the other side of the development about 15 mi away and it immediately dropped to 30% - never happened before so I turned around and came back the short way. About a mile away from the cabin (and all uphill) "reduced power" light comes on (at 20%??) and it only goes a few yards then dies - I continue to turn off/on and try to inch a few yards but eventually the hill just makes it impossible. We hiked back in the blazing sun and got the car and towed it back w kayak tie down straps. (ordered car tow straps shortly after) - I plugged it in and then connected the laptop - I have emailed the guys at Voltronix and sent them the live cell data and event log so let's see what they say - I opened it up and cleaned off both packs and everything looks fine(?)
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Discussion Starter #49 (Edited)
Well, color me stupid - I should've gone back and looked at the original data, since there are only 16 cells of course those last four show zero. 🙄 The guys at Voltronix got back with me and I sent the data dump to them, hopefully this is something simple and the SOC was just showing wrong. One thing to make note of tho is at 20% when "reduced power" comes on, it basically goes a few yards and shuts off, and def cant make it uphill, so Ill never let it get that low - the weird thing was the immediate drop from 60-30, maybe it was due to the fact that I didnt get a full charge - maybe just plug in every night if its anywhere close to 50% from now on. Ill post back when we get it resolved.

---update - Alfonso with Voltronix got back with me right away and said the data snapshot I sent didnt really show errors, may be a glitch in the BMS or a loose connection from a voltage wire - he did send me a new BMS profile that monitors SOC better he said, so I loaded that and its plugged in. makes me a bit nervous going too far from home but I'll keep an eye on it.

Just FYI, the SOC meter shows a bit diff than I had assumed - I had assumed 3 lights meant 30% but it does not - per Voltronix - this makes more sense with "reduced power" coming on at 2 lights.
10 - 100 - 91
9 - 90 - 81
8 - 80 - 71
7 - 70 - 61
6 - 60 - 51
5 - 50 - 41
4 - 40 - 31
3 - 30 - 21
2 - 20 - 11
 

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They told me it would it would damage the batteries if I let it get below 20%. if mine ever gets to 20% I’m getting off and walking. I’ll be dang if I’m gonna destroy a 7-8000.00 dollar set of batteries . You were lucky. Sorry guys what it is is what it is
 
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They told me it would it would damage the batteries if I let it get below 20%.------------------------------------
They didn't tell me that. I ran it down below 20% several times three years ago right after I installed the conversion and a few times after that: SOC dropped to 15%

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Didn't seem to damage the batteries, they are still working fine (y).
 

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I’ve been told it doesn’t hurt this chemistry of lithium batteries. Kinda like a Apple phone just shuts down when gets to low even though some power is left in the cells. Now I’m wondering though which is actually correct? So does it hurt them or not. Maybe Voltronix could elaborate for us.


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I was it might have been just a suggestion but that was about 3 years ago on a conversation with Brennan about how to charge and when. Good to know.
 

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Its really down to the BMS. If its not letting you use power under a certain voltage then all is OK to go to that point. The lifepo4 really are at the point of falling off a cliff (voltage) when they get to about 2.8v. If they are the WInston/ Thundersky / Sino poly. If they are Calb, they will still be giving power at 2.5v with no problems. Just do what the makers of the kit say. As with going high voltage the cell vo;tages across the pack also start to diverge as they get towards the end of charge, so keeping above that level means fewer issues with voltage divergence and unwanted cell damage. Discharge under load at very very low voltage will cause swelling of the cells.
 

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Discussion Starter #55
They didn't tell me that. I ran it down below 20% several times three years ago right after I installed the conversion and a few times after that: SOC dropped to 15%

View attachment 23793

View attachment 23794


Didn't seem to damage the batteries, they are still working fine (y).
So based on what I was told yesterday by they tech guy, when you see those 2 bars it means that the SOC is somewhere between 11 and 20% - so that was why "Reduced Power" came on which basically meant you were stopped - the BMS will never let you run it so low you damage the batteries, so that is not a concern - however, I di want to make sure I can get home. LOL All is well so far with one (shorter) ride last night to the top of the mountain - ~18 miles 1000' elevation change and I have nine lights on so 81-90% left.
 

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Discussion Starter #56
Its really down to the BMS. If its not letting you use power under a certain voltage then all is OK to go to that point. The lifepo4 really are at the point of falling off a cliff (voltage) when they get to about 2.8v. If they are the WInston/ Thundersky / Sino poly. If they are Calb, they will still be giving power at 2.5v with no problems. Just do what the makers of the kit say. As with going high voltage the cell vo;tages across the pack also start to diverge as they get towards the end of charge, so keeping above that level means fewer issues with voltage divergence and unwanted cell damage. Discharge under load at very very low voltage will cause swelling of the cells.
Do you think its ok to leave it plugged in? I notice with this Li pack the charge light in the dahs goes off after it fully charges, but then the next am if its still left it it starts blinking again, I assume trickle charging? I plugged the laptop in yesterday after a full charge and one cell #6 showed 3.93 and red, it said it was balancing. it would go red and then clear - so I unplug it when its fully charged unlike the lead acid - which would have a solid green charge light if it was full.
 

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I do this with mine sometimes I think it is good to leave it plugged in and maybe check what the batteries are doing. Sometimes even after full charge it seems to keep balancing batteries as indicated by red squares
 
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Depends on the algorithm they have used. Most of the Li version actually turn the charger off after a preset number of hours. So as to ensure the cells dont get over charged. Li algorithms dont do a trickle charge. They go CC COnstant current upto a given end of charge voltage then shift to CV constant voltage, until the current reaches a pre set low value. I tend to set a lot of chargers to not go to the CV stage, it tends to add little but you can get more voltage divergence as the packs age. My choice is CC then stop. The chargers once stopped will need to be cycled to re start.Ie mains off . But how this works with the Voltronic is dependant on the algorithm they have gone for. They could of course use the BMS to turn off the charger, I like to use that as a back up, so the charger does its course and the BMS only cuts the charge off if a cell goes high voltage or too hot. .
 

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Discussion Starter #59
Depends on the algorithm they have used. Most of the Li version actually turn the charger off after a preset number of hours. So as to ensure the cells dont get over charged. Li algorithms dont do a trickle charge. They go CC COnstant current upto a given end of charge voltage then shift to CV constant voltage, until the current reaches a pre set low value. I tend to set a lot of chargers to not go to the CV stage, it tends to add little but you can get more voltage divergence as the packs age. My choice is CC then stop. The chargers once stopped will need to be cycled to re start.Ie mains off . But how this works with the Voltronic is dependant on the algorithm they have gone for. They could of course use the BMS to turn off the charger, I like to use that as a back up, so the charger does its course and the BMS only cuts the charge off if a cell goes high voltage or too hot. .
Great info, thanks! Yesterday coming back I put the buggy in High and noticed that the SOC meter actually climbed 20% - I emailed Alfonso from Voltronix and he replied back replied back and said that when regen kicks in going downhill sometimes the meter can not register properly. I only went down one hill the rest was flat or slightly uphill. Next time this happens Ill plug the laptop in to see what the software reads as SOC, seems a bit off to me. Maybe after putting it in High I need to plug it to get the SOC reset or something.
 

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Can’t remember but maybe there is info in the installation manual about this.
 
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